John was born in December 1167. He was at most 21 and you may maybe more youthful than simply that in case his child Joanna came into this world. She may well were the fresh new eldest of all the people the guy fathered by their various mistresses.
1187 Summer - John in France whenever Chateauroux had been besieged 1187 June 23 - truce 1188 The month of january. 31 - Henry returns so you can England, perhaps with John inside the pull 1188 Summer - Henry delivers John back into Normandy, crosses regarding 1189 Summer 12 - John in the Le Mans whenever disarmed by the Henry's acquisition, and then John escaped otherwise is actually added aside having security 1189 July six - Henry We becomes deceased from inside the France 1189 Aug. several - Richard will bring John returning to The united kingdomt that have him 1189 Aug. 30 - John hitched so you can Isabelle of Gloucester on Marlebridge 1189 September. step 3 - Richard crowned at Westminster Abbey 1189 October. - Richard sends John on the Wales to help you subdue the fresh rebellious Welsh 1190 Feb. - John summoned in order to Normandy and you can pushed to the oath not to set legs towards pretty Bucha in Ukraine ladies the The united kingdomt for three many years 1190 June - Richard continues on crusade [John vacation trips his oath] In regards to our motives, it is considered that one several months, as well as the extremely more than likely going back to Joanna getting come devised, is the 1187-nine months. 1187 - John spends around the year from inside the France 1188 - John may have gone back to The united kingdomt inside the January, but because of the summer is distributed back into France, in which he seemingly have stayed 1189 - John is apparently during the France January - August, going back to help you England inside the August in preparation having their matrimony into the 31 Aug. If the John produced no more unrecorded productivity so you can The united kingdomt, it appears that he spent in the 80% from their time away from January 1187 up to their marriage, in France . He was will eventually considering the State out of Mortain, in the Normandy (ahead of Richard's coronation).
The above guidance, because of the months therefore the simple fact that Joanna is delivered to England away from France for the 1203 getting their own relationships so you can Llywelyn, lends credence into the proven fact that Joanna along with her mother were regarding French/Norman resource.
Given plus John's better-recognized philandering during this time, indeed there seems to be many individuals with the role regarding mother off Joanna!
Immediately after an alternative a lot of time browse not, I’m able to see zero trace from a Clemence de- Dauntsey from inside the new info
My earlier blog post offered the information that Paget showed that it are Clemence de- Dauntsey, who married Nicholas de- Verdun. We believed that it was the new Nicholas and you may Clementia to help you who Henry 111 provided new infant custody away from Susanna (since the an excellent hostage) inside 1228. I did so come across not, the brand new viewpoint of 1 genealogist which certainly stated it as…’ I believe that individuals (new genealogists) have established there is actually zero such as for example individual once the Clemence de- Dauntsey. One to personality of the partner away from Nicholas de Verdun was a mistake from the Paget!’
Clemence le Boteler came to be regarding 1175 within the Steeple Lavington, Wiltshire
I’m prepared to believe that achievement, given that further research of your own info of your own second Clemence turned-out so much more productive.
Clemence le Boteler married Nicholas de Verdun from inside the 1202 (his second partner shortly after his relationship so you can Joan Fitz Piers. Mention, which marriage isn’t shown) in the Alton, Staffordshire and they had one child, Rohese de Verdun who was simply produced inside 1203 otherwise 1205 (died. Feb 1247).
If the, indeed, Joanna is actually the consequence of an excellent liaison between John and you may Clemence le Boteler (who would was old as much as 14-15 at that time), it could were very hard into the Ce Boteler family members to track down the right spouse to own Clemence. In reality specific a decade pass ahead of a good ily?) that have a trusting English nobleman and you can assets manager, Nicholas de- Verdun. Making away for now the possibility that Nicholas got fallen in love with brand new twenty-seven year-old Clemence and desired to marry their own, it could was indeed necessary for John to add Clemence that have certain possessions from her own so as that she turned into a far more glamorous award to own their particular husband to be.